Ford Smart Charging System

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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby Dcunning35 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:46 pm

The silver coating is basically to help stop sulphation of the plates . The smart charge will work if the battery capacity and architecture meet the pcm calibration.
Lead acid batteries may not like the aggressive deep cycling and may dry out or even boil a big problem when we have twin batteries on transits located under the drivers seat.
Nobody likes an exploding battery or a lung full of noxious fumes I would stay safe and replace in acordance with manufacturer recomedations
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby Dcunning35 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:55 pm

Technician , how did you get on today ? . Generator proven faulty or is the jury still out? .

This is a really usefull forum and I have found some really great test ideas from the likes of stc, richard,and volrem to name a few surely we can all share opinions and our experiences good and bad without falling out.
Danny
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby Technician » Mon Mar 27, 2017 11:23 pm

Spoke to the auto electrician this morning and he advised that he had not looked at the alternator at that time, he advised he would ring me when he had. It'll more than likely be tomorrow now as he has not rang me today.

Tomorrow is another day, I'm waiting eagerly to see what the auto electrician says about the alternator, I'll let you know tomorrow.

Thanks again Danny
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby Technician » Mon Mar 27, 2017 11:57 pm

Spoke to the customer this evening, I am advised that the problem now being experienced with the car is around two years old, back then the car had the same problem and the RAC advised the customer the car was not being driven enough, a new battery was then fitted at that time and afterwards at some point the RAC was called again, the RAC again advised the car was not being driven enough, but this time he put a battery charging device across the battery wired in so that the battery could be remotely charged each time the battery drained, this was around two years ago. The final fail was this time when the car started and ran OK but after a 30 mile drive and stopping the car would not re-start, the battery was discharged, a jump start and the engine started immediately. Let's wait for the outcome of the alternator tomorrow.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby Dcunning35 » Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:52 am

So this is a low mileage, low duty cycle vehicle? .
And looking very much like a classic reason why ford adopted the bms system to assist in battery management.
No doubt the battery is toast 2years in service with a low duty cycle and you would be supprised at the level.of consumers on that vehicle.
I would replace battery await the alternator verdict and carry out and extended drain check
Danny
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby Technician » Wed Mar 29, 2017 7:59 pm

Today I consider the Ford Fiesta a fix.

The details;

Alternator was tested on the car and found to be not charging, then the alternator was removed and taken to the auto electricians for test and repair. The auto electricians advised at point of collection that the regulator had failed. Today I put the alternator back on and put a brand new battery on, fully charged. Run the engine and measured for charging voltage using VERUS, the PID that shows Generator/Alternator voltage set point (v) recorded 13.2. The ECM supply via PID was 12.3V.

At this point I was still thinking from live data that I still had a problem, so I put the voltmeter across the battery terminals and the measurement was 12.50V, with the engine running, this was a problem when comparing to live data, so I checked volt drop again through battery and earth cables, I could not measure any volt drop, hence readings like 0.00, so I was a bit stumped, then I decided to stop the engine remove all battery cables and earth straps, check each visually and clean the ends of the cables and mounting points, including the bolts, replaced all cables and using the volt meter I recorded the readings, this time I had 13.2V everywhere I tested and no measured volt drop, I then loaded the alternator at idle with everything electrical the car has fitted, the battery voltage dropped to 12.50V or there abouts, but not below this figure at idle, then I increased the revs to around 3K, the battery voltage increased to around 12.8 - 12.9V, fully loaded.

With all loads removed and back at idle the voltage returned to 13.2V, both at the battery terminals with the volt meter, and using the VERUS live data.

Without any other evidence I have to conclude that the regulator fitted is regulated to 13.2V, and based on the above readings the battery should now remain charged during use of the car, providing the car is driven sufficiently.

Any comments/views most welcome.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby volrem » Wed Mar 29, 2017 8:31 pm

Did you check for correct information in Ford ETIS?

For Volvo Smart Charge systems at +40C battery temperature voltage has to be between 13,27V and 14,07V.
Higher temperature lowers voltage and vice versa.

Did I understand correctly that "PID that shows Generator/Alternator voltage set point (v) recorded 13.2" means requested voltage by control module?

Does it have Bosch alternator? Did you check if it has LIN communication?
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby Technician » Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:14 am

volrem wrote:Did you check for correct information in Ford ETIS?

For Volvo Smart Charge systems at +40C battery temperature voltage has to be between 13,27V and 14,07V.
Higher temperature lowers voltage and vice versa.

Did I understand correctly that "PID that shows Generator/Alternator voltage set point (v) recorded 13.2" means requested voltage by control module?

Does it have Bosch alternator? Did you check if it has LIN communication?


Sorry no I did not check Ford ETIS, I didn't think Ford would produce that information on ETIS.

The auto electrician who tested the alternator with the new regulator in advised that the voltage did rise to around 13.8V as current load was reduced.

Yes the PID shows Generator/Alternator voltage (v) as 13.2

Valeo alternator fitted. Yes single wire twin LIN terminal.

A Valeo TSB advises that if the LIN terminal is disconnected while ignition off and then start engine, check voltage output at B+ should see charging voltage, I did this and thought the alternator was faulty, however pointing this out to the auto electrician he showed me that check on another same type alternator would not work, apparently you can't use that method of testing on the single wire LIN, I didn't know it was single wire until removed, visual access very impaired on the car. I can see the real value of having to be subscribed to the original manufacturer information these days rather than AD, who in my experience now are not providing sufficient technical data/detail anymore to carryout diagnostics with any accuracy, at least for me anyway.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby volrem » Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:44 pm

Technician wrote:
Sorry no I did not check Ford ETIS, I didn't think Ford would produce that information on ETIS.



Only one way to find out if that information is available at ETIS. :wink:
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Re: Ford Smart Charging System

Postby Dcunning35 » Thu Mar 30, 2017 8:41 pm

The only info regarding this is brief basic description of main components but volrem your bang on with how the pcm controls it.
The best to find info is within e learning sections under bmax or smart charging systems.
With newer models we ford are back to using a 3wire smart generator as of old with cmd and feedback and a ref supply.
The smart reqenerative stuff all has a bms to calculate the actual battery soc.
Hope this helps
Danny
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