Hesitant E46

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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Avdr » Tue Jun 19, 2012 5:05 pm

Here is the CKP/CMP capture, also have one at 20ms/div, let me know if you want that one, just doesn't show two full revolutions on one screen.
318ti CKP, CMP SINGLE 50MS.psdata
(1.34 MiB) Downloaded 241 times


Here is cyl1 at idle when it was idling rough at one point
cy1 pri sec.psdata
(1.82 MiB) Downloaded 214 times


An overview from all seconday's at idle, with cyl3 showing a really short dwell
cyl3 secondary - dwell problem.psdata
(1.31 MiB) Downloaded 223 times

That was the bosch coil,

But when captured later on sometime I got decent looking signals ie.
cyl3 pri sec smooth.psdata
(389.72 KiB) Downloaded 194 times


and other times I got a very jagged signal
cyl3 pri sec jagged.psdata
(390.9 KiB) Downloaded 185 times

worth mentioning that in all the above captures, the characteristics of the fault didn't change

compared to a typical capture from cyl4
cy4 pri sec.psdata
(392.49 KiB) Downloaded 189 times


Will have a look at forcing rich, can I do this by feeding propane into the intake air? Not neat propane, just some.

And as for lean, partially clamp delivery pipe to fuel rail? FPR is remote, on the end of filter assy.. Or would it be better to vacuum FPR to reduce pressure that way?

Took the car out before to have a word with its owner, and it ran bloody awful, once warm. Engine light came on, so quicly plugged in, only to find no DTC's
Took a screen grab, just look at the lambda ratio for bank 1 - thats seriously lean if its to be believed, or atleast thats the condition being reported, which would trigger a huge amount of excess fueling. Then there's the current required by the pump chamber which backs up the reported condition.

grabondeliv.JPG


The quest continues...
Thanks All
Oh and he did give me the go ahead to try what I thought was worth trying, even if I couldn't guarentee a fix from component x /y /z alone.
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Robski » Tue Jun 19, 2012 6:27 pm

Andy

The ignition captures show a distinct lean in cylinder condition.

Are you 100 % sure the timing is correct ie used the correct alignment tools ?

Yes you can have a wag round with propane,round the inlet & engine to check for air leaks, and into the inlet to force a rich situation.To force lean you can take a pipe off the inlet so it draws extra air ie servo pipe & watch the O2's reactions.

Can you perform a relearn on the valvetronic system ?

What scan tool are you using mainly on this ? I think maybe a better tool is reqd for better codes/data ?
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Avdr » Tue Jun 19, 2012 6:53 pm

to answer each in order...

No the alignment tools I made myself, but I have 100% confidence in their accuracy. All that is required for camshafts is that the flat profiles at the end be perpendicular to upper head face, when No.1 is at TDC. There is a sensor wheel alignment tool also, but I marked those prior to removal.
I should add this fault existed before the timing failure, the customer had lived with it for 10months, add to that the fact it runs pefectly when cold, and I am happy to rule out any error on my part with timing/building back up.

I can't command a relearn via serial. I have spoken to hickleys on that very subject and they said neither Bavarian technic nor KTS would be able to do it either. Only way to command a relearn without ISTA or some "hexscanner" thingywotsit is to manually move eccentric shaft from the postion it normally comes to rest in when engine is shut down. A relearn has taken place, under command of ECU - this I know for sure, as the fault code has dissapeared and I could see the shaft had moved afterward.

Using a texa navigator txt, which to be frank is not a cheap tool, it is sometimes lacking in areas though (as they all are - except dealer) I have been trying to get hold of ISTA/D as I could run it in Pass-thru mode using the TXT, which would give dealer level on BMW - however getting a download of ISTA is easier said than done.

So I've got lean in cylinders, and lean on one o2 sensor - which is in open loop, LTFT's showing approx +8% on fuelling - which backs up the lean trend, and a second o2 sensor showing fairly normal operation.

What a mess.
EDIT: What do you make of that dwell time on cyl3?
Thanks
Further EDIT: I have read that throttle is normally sat fully open, with valvetronic doing all the metering of air under normal conditions, meaning manifold would rarely be under vacuum, seems to ring true, as they have a camshaft driven vacuum pump for servo.
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Avdr » Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:05 pm

I have got a wideband lambda controller kit from 14point7. Could use that to determine fuelling across entire rev range, throttle positions etc.
but would have to weld boss' into the exhausts to use it.
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby mastertech02 » Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:57 pm

How did you mark sensor wheels before removal ?

Regards
Dennis Carey
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Robski » Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:30 pm

Andy

Check PM's.........
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Avdr » Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:16 pm

mastertech02 wrote:How did you mark sensor wheels before removal ?

Regards
Dennis Carey


With reference to head upper face with cam alignment tools fitted.
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Avdr » Sat Jun 23, 2012 1:46 pm

This is now the third time I've written this post. Patience is wearing thin where technology is concerned.

Have now timed the sensor wheels using BMW tool. Having re-assembled the car I have taken the following captures:

At idle with fault present.
Cylinder 1
230612 cyl1 idle.psdata


Cylinders 2 - 4
230612 cyl2 idle.psdata


Cylinder 1 using bosch coil, cylinders 2-4 using bremi coils.

EOBD info at time of captures
230612 eobd.JPG

Shows both lambda sensors working in closed loop.

Cylinder 1 as the engine was revved up
230612 cyl1 revved up.psdata


Cylinder 2 as it settled back down having been revved up, secondary's don't seem to correlate with primary
cyl2 random secondary.psdata


Cylinder 4 showing much the same plus multiple firing of injector
230612 cyl4 random secondary plus injector.psdata



Thanks in advance for any help

Andy
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Robski » Sat Jun 23, 2012 7:28 pm

Have now timed the sensor wheels using BMW tool


Were they out ?
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Re: Hesitant E46

Postby Avdr » Mon Jun 25, 2012 6:58 am

Robski wrote:Were they out ?


Yes but only by a few degrees of crankshaft rotation. Getting coils today.
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