AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby Dan » Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:59 am

I can imagine the fault codes appearing if the pump was disconnected, especially if ignition was on when done so.

Robski wrote:I would deploy 3 Channels at the fuel pump connector end to get an idea whats happening first, power,ground & current.

Either way you will see what is shorting whether its to ground or positive, & also a look at the pumps internal integrity, as those codes suggest,but i would get it on IDS also to verify those two codes .

Then the issue can be traced.


Good point.

One thing (of many) to check with the current clamp is how much is the pump drawing.
High can mean the pump is turning too slow - say fuel filter, grit or bearings.
Low can even mean the pump is blocked on input, running dry!

Best compared with a known comparison, or even if a fuel pressure sensor is scoped (the above 2 will read low pressure).
Knows pre-2000 Fords and R33's better than the back of my own hand.
Anything newer... I'm probably driving it :-(
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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby Liteace » Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:52 pm

Sorry to interfere but would just to add a bit, over here on this rock Ive had loads of Mk1's all with fuel pump failure, our Foad main dealer keeps next to nothing in stock, everything has to be ordered in, I was very surprised they had a pump unit in stock, not 1 but 3, they parts guy said there cant be any Mk1's left on the road thats still running with the original f\pump, they all fail. I was also very surprised at the price the tank unit was just over 100 quid for a genuine Ford part, again the parts guy said Fords have done them cheaper cause they all fail
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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby Dan » Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:44 am

Had Ford changed the pumps a bit then for the Mk1's?
They used to be a bit more generic...

I'm assuming yes, as Escorts/Fez/Mondeo of that era are still running. :lol:
Knows pre-2000 Fords and R33's better than the back of my own hand.
Anything newer... I'm probably driving it :-(
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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby AuthorMike » Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:41 am

Thanks (again) guys. I am hoping to scope this Saturday afternoon if it stays dry...worst case I'll clear the garage ajnd do it in there, but it might be tight.

8)
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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby AuthorMike » Thu Jun 21, 2012 11:13 am

Hi all,

Right we should be taking a better look at this on Friday PM, or Saturday AM, but we need some specific info...

Do any of you know, or can you find out the ‘good’ RPM & current for the fuel pump?


Thanks,

Mike
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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby Liteace » Thu Jun 21, 2012 6:12 pm

AuthorMike wrote:Hi all,

Right we should be taking a better look at this on Friday PM, or Saturday AM, but we need some specific info...

Do any of you know, or can you find out the ‘good’ RPM & current for the fuel pump?


Thanks,

Mike



I think Robski is the man to advise us on that one, Ive not used the current clamps as yet
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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby GRUSS » Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:47 pm

I've had previous experience with faulty mk1 fuel pumps but will be interesting to see what the scope shows :D
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**-*UPDATE*-**

Postby AuthorMike » Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:01 am

Hi All,

Here we are with waveforms :)

Key on, Engine off. Here we have the old pump (this is where the pump runs for 2 seconds at switch on to pressurise the fuel lines).

20120622-0002 - KOn-EOff - Steady State Current and RPM.gif



..and the new pump :) Key on, Engine off (where the pump runs for 2 seconds at switch on to pressurise the fuel lines).

20120715-0003 - Kon-EOff - New Pump - Smoother Wave.gif



However, we also have some interesting additonal waveforms..


Key on, Engine on (first start after installation of new pump). A few anomalies in the pattern, and also a steep drop off in current after each rotor. Could this just be the rotors needing to wear in?

20120715-0001 - Kon-EOn - New Pump.gif



Key on, Engine on, after a short drive to the fuel station and an elongated route home. Low current points look clean, however at about ¾ current there is an unusual shoulder present on every segment – what would cause this? Approx 5.03 -> 6.77A drawn

20120715-0002 - Kon-EOn - New Pump - After 5 minutes drive.gif



Key on, Engine on, with the engine running and additional loads applied (front & rear heated screens, full beam lights & fogs). Wave looks a lot cleaner, and closer to what was expected, although the peaks still seem to be flattened.
Current has now dropped to approx 4.37 -> 5.86 A (based on previous observations this is because the supply voltage will have dropped from the usual 14.4V to now being almost 12V – the Focus doesn’t not seem to cope well with both screen heaters on!).

20120715-0004 - Kon-EOn - New Pump - Lights and Heaters On.gif



Key on, Engine on,Taken immediately after previous, but now with the additional loads (f/r heated screens, lights & fogs) switched off. The shoulder has reappeared on the pattern. The current drawn has increased to 4.83 -> 6.38A (presumably as a result of the supply voltage now recovering back to approx 14.4V as the additional loads have been removed).

20120715-0005 - Kon-EOn - New Pump - Additional Loads Off - Shoulder back.gif
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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby Robski » Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:15 pm

I would say let the brushes wear into the commutator & grab another capture then.

As long as the fuel pressure is to spec & can be seen to increase with the current on a dead head test I wouldn't worry too much about it.
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Re: AuthorMike - Ford Focus Mk1 – 2000 X reg

Postby AuthorMike » Mon Jul 16, 2012 12:27 pm

Thanks, my thoughts were similar. Allow the brushes to wear in, and do another test. Wasn't sure if anyone had seen these signs before, rather than us just assuming.

Thanks Rob :)
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