Ford Smart Charging Systems

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Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:49 pm

Hi, I'm looking for a test procedure to check the single wire LIN smart charging system on Fords, the current car is charging the battery but either when alternator loaded or not the voltage does not seem to increase from 13.14V, it will however drop to around 12.8V loaded. The customer does not drive the car a lot and when driven are mainly short trips around 5 to 10 miles, stopping the car in between journeys.

I just checked the battery as part of a service and found that the battery was only 33% charged, the SOH showed 100%, the battery is only a few months old. I am leaning towards the PCM not increasing the alternator charging rate but would like a test procedure for the single wire LIN Ford if anyone has got one.

Thanks

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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby ben.martins » Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:35 pm

Hi Technician,

There are a number of variables that can affect battery charging and ultimately the battery is one of them. Before any sort of testing can be carried out you will need to make sure that the battery is of good health and fully charged. That being said it is still possible that the battery is faulty. Also, as we know, temperature plays a massive part in smart battery charging so maybe checking your data list on a scan tool for any anomalies is also worth doing. I believe some systems will use the air temp reading from the MAF as under bonnet temperature, so don't disregard this.

Speaking of the battery, can you confirm if the battery that was replaced a few months ago to be a genuine battery or at the least OEM?

LIN is a single wire data line, in this case between the Engine ECU and the Alternator. There is a great case study on our website with a BMW which uses BSD line. This is similar to LIN but the information being transferred is specific to BMW. That being said the voltages are identical to that of a standard LIN BUS and will hopefully help you understand a little more about this simple network.The link here will take you to the case study.

https://www.picoauto.com/library/case-studies/2003-bmw-5-series-4-4-v8-communication-error

There is also another post on the forum already which I believe was from yourself enquiring about smart charging however, I believe at the time you were unable to upload PSDATA files.

https://www.picoauto.com/support/topic16621.html?hilit=LIN

If you were to upload now could you capture the LIN network, Battery voltage and Current on start up? Hopefully this will give an overview what is going on with the battery and we can use the serial decode option in the software to see if there are any issues with data transfer from ECU and alternator.

Hope this helps

Kind regards

Ben
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:01 pm

Thanks Ben,

I am collecting the car, Fiesta tonight and am going to investigate tomorrow, this time Pico can be used to analyse what is going on, I'll upload the results as soon as I have them. :)

I'll comment on your questions when I upload the data files.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Sat Feb 17, 2018 12:40 am

That's an excellent write up regarding the BMW 545 E60 charging system communication error. When I removed the regulator from the Fiesta alternator originally I also observed the alternator slip rings appearing very worn, and when I asked the auto electrician about these rings and their condition, he replied, I've seen them a lot worse than those!!

Maybe he had but had he on Smart Charge Systems?

I asked him back at the time had he repaired them and he advised he had, however I have some doubt at the moment, but I would like to of thought he had done what he said.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Dcunning35 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 6:28 pm

Have you some details of the fiesta , does this have a battery monitoring sensor fitted.
Connect your scope to the battery and the lin bus at the alternator start the car and watch the lin messages to the alternator . The set point for the generator is all within the pcm software . If the lin fails or the generator cannot generate the sufficient charge rate within the specified time you will get a dtc ,usually a u code depicting lost coms with generator control unit.
Things that get overlooked.
Engine earths
Ign coil ht spikes check the towers for corrosion and arching.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Sun Feb 18, 2018 10:48 pm

I've had the Pico on the car now and the first test I completed was the battery test. I tried to connect my amps clamp around the battery positive cable but Ford have secured it so well down the side of the battery, and my current clamp jaws (1000 A) unit were too big and clumsy to get round the cable, so not being on a ramp to get to the starter from the underside, I've not managed to get a current draw figure from the battery, but what I did try, which was not successful was to place the amps clamp around the battery negative terminal and see if the current actually returned to the battery!

I've not connected to the LIN today, but I have checked the alternator voltage output Verses Amperage output from engine idle through to 2500 RPM and varied the amperage load from minor to maximum the car is capable of demanding.

The alternator is capable of supplying 120A this I know from the data on the alternator itself, the scope trace shows the alternator is cable of supplying maximum current. I don't actually know whether the car has a monitoring sensor or not sorry!

Regarding the battery test results I'll assume the vertical black lines are there because of user error?
Attachments
Ford_Fiesta_2012_Petrol_80A Load @ 3K RPM.psdata
(9.08 MiB) Downloaded 56 times
Ford_Fiesta_2012_Petrol_2500 RPM Full 120A Load.psdata
(9.39 MiB) Downloaded 52 times
Ford_Fiesta_2012_Petrol_2500 RPM 80A load.psdata
(9.41 MiB) Downloaded 44 times
Ford_Fiesta_2012_Petrol_80A Load @ Idle.psdata
(8.92 MiB) Downloaded 55 times
Battery and starter test.pddata
Battery test
(2.97 MiB) Downloaded 58 times
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Dcunning35 » Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:48 am

You need to look.at the lin signal.as this is the control for the generator. The battery soc has direct influence is we have a bms sensor. If not its just a voltage increase at the pcm.power supply that gives verification.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Mon Feb 19, 2018 1:34 am

Thanks Danny, if I'd of known when I checked for DTC's I'd of had a look while the scanner was connected. I have not managed to find any other data about BMS on the Fiesta range but other Fords I'm lead to believe that once the battery has been connected more than 8 hours, the BMS resets itself?

If the Fiesta charging system had a problem of this nature regarding the BMS, would that not affect the charge output all the time?
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby ben.martins » Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:01 am

Hi Technician,

As Danny has mentioned you need to capture the LIN BUS. If BMS has an issue you should be able to see this a PID on your scan tool. From the the 3 wire type smart alternators with GenCOM, GenMON and sense, the system will default to 13.7V if there is a fault. In the captures you've uploaded I can see the voltage is holding around 13.31V which could be a default.

If you capture the LIN signal and post we should be able to decode and see if there is data being sent to and from the alternator.

Kind regards

Ben
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:39 am

Thanks Ben,

Is there any difference between the three wire and single wire LIN system?

Mine is the single wire system

Regards

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