Ford Smart Charging Systems

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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby ben.martins » Mon Feb 19, 2018 2:04 pm

Hi Technician,

LIN BUS will allow data to be transferred to and from the alternator via a single wire. The plug for these alternators do tend to have a two pin connector but only one of the terminals is utilised. The 3 wire type does exactly what it says on the tin! 3 wires all used where GenCOM, GenMON and sense.

Hope this helps

Kind regards

Ben
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:22 am

Thanks Ben,

I am going to get the car back to check the LIN and the BMS if fitted!!

I have looked on AD for this car regarding battery advice, there is some information there but nothing about bms, and after reconnecting the battery they advise;

After battery connection
All models
Access fault memories and erase trouble codes.
Electric windows and sunroof
Switch ignition ON.
Lift and hold window switch to fully close window.
Release switch.
Lift and hold window switch for 1 second.
Press and hold window switch to fully open window.
Release switch.
Lift and hold window switch to fully close window.
Check window operates correctly.
If not, repeat procedure.
Repeat procedure for remaining windows.
Switch ignition OFF.
Remote alarm/central locking
No procedures are specified for this model range.
Driving position memory functions
No procedures are specified for this model range.
Electrical power management
No procedures are specified for this model range.
Telematics
No procedures are specified for this model range.
Additional systems
No procedures are specified for this model range.

They don't mention a BMS reset after battery removal and re-connection so I'll have to plug the scanner back in and check, will probably be Wednesday now when I get chance so will post back then.

Thanks again

Regards

Tech
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Dcunning35 » Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:04 am

If it has bms its fitted to the battery negative terminal and associated pids for battery soc etc are all.within the bcmii.
This doesn't sound to difficult the lin bus is is very different than.earlier smart charging as this can charge at up to 15.7v as normal to deep cycle the battery.
Hence one reason battery size type and
Quality are important
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Dcunning35 » Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:07 am

The bms has to be reset even if the battery has been charged of the vehicle.
Ign on press rear fog 4times and hazards twice.
If that doesn't work the bms will refresh after a period with no load usually overnight . Your soc pid will confirm this .
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:03 pm

Thanks Danny, I'll try your options at the weekend when the car returns. I'll also complete the LIN signature and upload the psdata file.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Dcunning35 » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:45 am

If you post the vin I will look up the spec see if it has smart regenerative charging .
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:53 pm

OK I've had the chance to put the pico back on the charging system, the data is below;

I had a look through the menus regarding what to set the LIn settings to and was unsure, so I set the LIN using duty cycle. I ran the engine at idle speed no loads and 3K full loads, the three traces are battery voltage, LIn and amperage.

I also connected the scanner (VERUS) and went through EVERY module that could be seen to check for any signs of a BMS, the only thing I found was in the PCM module which referred to an ECM re-learn, so I looked at the scope before and after I did the re-learn, nothing changed. I ran the engine for quite some time and the cooling fan was cutting in and out as normal, the pico did not show any marked changes in voltages from the present data shown, in other words, the voltages never increased from what you can seen at the bottom of the pico.

At this time without further information, I can see the charging system is working over and above battery voltage whether loaded or unloaded, the battery is remaining 100% charged while the car is left in my custody and control (custody) might not be the correct type of word to use :lol:, however, at this time I'm not convinced I can say there actually is a fault!

In line with the bold comment in the last line above I have had some additional information provided now by AD, apparently Ford advise to use their Ford diagnostic equipment for checking their systems out, most likely the VCM2 diagnostic unit. AD advised as you professionals also pointed out Ford vehicles don't like pattern parts, so the regulator fitted and the battery (not Ford) fitted although the parts department advised the battery was suitable might not be recommended by Ford, I'm now not sure about that, but it is looking like we should only fit genuine parts nowadays.

I don't think the customer will do anymore with this car so it might be brought to a close now at this point.

Thanks for all your help guys, its very much appreciated.
Attachments
Ford_Fiesta_2012_Petrol_W3HDW 3K RPM.psdata
(13.34 MiB) Downloaded 127 times
Ford_Fiesta_2012_Petrol_W3HDW idle value no load.psdata
(11.68 MiB) Downloaded 111 times
Last edited by Technician on Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:54 pm

Dcunning35 wrote:If you post the vin I will look up the spec see if it has smart regenerative charging .


I don't think I kept a copy but I can arrange to get it, will PM it to you.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Dcunning35 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 12:43 am

If theres a bms it will be on the battery negative terminal , at the bms sensor ,2wires one red battery voltage, one white lin bus.
The bms only updates the bcm with battery data so the pcm can command the generator accordingly.
If the battery isnt the same size or type the bms will interpret the soc incorrectly.

If the vehicle is a sigma engine it wont have smart regenerative charging but will have a lin generator.
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Re: Ford Smart Charging Systems

Postby Technician » Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:05 am

Thanks Danny,

AD advise the following;

I am unaware of any bms reset, i have checked through the manufacturers system, against the vehicles vin number. and nothing is shown, although the tests they do list, if the charging is outside of certain parameters, they refer to the Ford diagnostic equipment, so, there may be a reset available, but only through that.

Their charging tests are as follows:

For a no load test, The voltage should be in the range of 14,1-15,1V, and if the voltage increase is less than 2,5 volts above the base voltage, carry out a load test, but....if the voltage increase is greater than 2,5 volts refer to the Ford diagnostic equipment.

For a load test, with engine running, turn A/C on, blower to high speed and main beam on, engine speed at 2000 rpm, the voltage should increase a minimum of 0,5 volts above the base voltage, if this does not increase as specified, refer to the Ford diagnostic tool, if the voltage increases as specified , the system is operating correctly.

The vehicle of course does run a smart charge system, now i can't find any specific values, but from memory, if there is an issue, it will put itself into a limp home scenario and charge permanent at approx 14,8V.

Certainly from experience, Ford's and smart charge systems don't seem to like any form of aftermarket alternator, and anything that is replaced that is not genuine, i have heard of issues showing up though the charging system.

I'll check the battery leads for the bms, but I'm sure its not fitted as I have changed the battery and noticed nothing connected.

Interesting how AD advise that limp home defaults to 14.8V if an issue is present, yet the car remains at 13.59V and no fault codes etc. I am not sure what to make of it to be honest!

Thanks again for your help members very much appreciated.
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